Hoshino Minami (Minami) / 1st gen

I have seen more animosity on the internet from Japanese fans about this particular case than about any other similar case that I can recall. Aside from the Twitter reaction that has been mentioned above, a female fan is currently streaming a "Hoshino Minami I will never forgive you" channel on a popular video platform, so I'm not sure that the disapproval is limited to only "incels and creeps".

Note that this is an observation, not an endorsement. Perhaps the reactions that I have seen are not representative, but those attitudes genuinely do exist.

 

Do you have a link to that stream?

 

Thank you for chiming in on this.

I started following this group after coming across one of their music videos and subsequently found enjoyment in watching their variety shows.

I'm fully aware that the industry promotes the single status of these girls in order to appeal to certain individuals and subsequently profit from them. From a business perspective, yeah, it makes perfect sense to get as much money out of these fans. I'm more so questioning whether it's ethical for an industry to rely so heavily on selling an idea or fantasy that fosters unhealthy, obsessive behavior.

I'd say the music is secondary and since I'm not in Japan and have no interest on the handshake aspect, I definitely find the idea of buying multiple copies of a single a waste.

Not quite sure what kind of business model would be profitable in Japan but having fewer members should allow for lower operating cost and reduce any consequent disparity in popularity among the group. The change I'd wish to see is to just get rid of the dating ban and let fans who wish to support the group without delusion, do so without feeling involved with the members' personal lives. If fans lose interest in the group due to a member being romantically involved, then so be it. With no rule to be broken, obsessed fans who've created their fantasy have no grounds to show contempt.

Toxic behavior as in losing all sense of self-awareness, spending huge chunks of money to fulfill a delusional idea of having a connection with an idol and then reacting angrily when said idol no longer appears as pure as they were in their fantastical mind.

If we're talking about commitment in the sense of Hoshino pretending to be sick on a day she has a job to do? Yes, by all means, she deserves all criticism for that. If you're referring to commitment in the sense of fulfilling her pure and innocent image, then no, let the girl grow up and experience an organic relationship. If there is in fact a "love ban" clause in her contract then let Nogi management deal with that. Assuming you're not one of those extreme, deluded fans, then it's fine to be disappointed, so long as it doesn't escalate to lashing out with hatred for the girl.

No. This would be like you criticizing a football player caught going out with a love interest.

Mod edit: Please don't double post. Thank you

 

The concept of idol in japan is different. Many idols are recruited not based on their talent but the promising growth they could achieve. Hence they do rely on the support of the fans, and the fans want to spend money to see the growth of the idol they support. Many of those fans are engaging in idols to fill their loneliness or want to experience to raise a kid without have to have a kid. If you raise a child, you don't want her to be bad right.

And idol job is only a stepping stone. Most of them dream to be actress, being part of musical, singers, model, entertainer, presenter etc. The expectation on them are lower than the professionals because idols are bringing spectators and attentions. And these creepy and obsessive fans are the ones who support them in front row when they make stage debut or buy multiple copies of their gravure debut.

"we will support our idol until she is ready to graduate and chasing her dream", is a quote that i think i heard somewhere on weeb interview. So these creepy fans wish is that the idol focus on her growth. If the idol can't focus and respect that, then graduate and become real artist.

I think you should do some research on how idol in japan are formed. Yes some fans are real creep, but many who feel betrayed are the ones who wish her the best and support her for real.

Disclaimer : I don't disregard idol group. The groups are producing proper music, they are artist. But the members are replaceable, that differentiate them with professional artists or idols from other countries.

 

Twice never had a dating ban. In fact there are no actual dating bans in kpop, it's more so that you're not supposed to be caught, especially not in the first couple of years of their career. NiziU might be marketed like Twice but I doubt they'd get a mild reaction like Momo and Jihyo's relationships got.

 

I don't mean for this to sound rude, I'm genuinely curious, but if they want what's best for her and support her then why do they feel betrayed? Based on the pictures it seems like a happy, loving relationship. Why wouldn't you want that for someone you support?

 

The site was live.nicovideo.jp and the one I mentioned above is by a user now named "星野みなみを一生許さない" with the title "大好きだった星野みなみさんについて思いの丈を思う存分に吐き出す放送"(!).

There's also been some coverage on yahoo.jp (e.g. https://news.yahoo.co.jp/articles/1e8b4065a37ff83702178d35eef7ca060cbe6bd9) that has attracted a lot of comments.

 

I too wondered if something like that would work to slowly change the culture and fan expectation. Perhaps like you said put out word (rumors) like some kpop companies do that there is a dating ban for the first 3 or 5 years. Perhaps they could do 5 years from debut + at least age 22. Get the fans at least mentally prepared.

It was taboo in the kpop world for idol dating also but recently fans of veteran artists like members of Twice and Red Velvet have become accepting of their members dating. So it is possible that some of the cultures can change slowly over time.

 

I think the love ban was created to protect idol's privacy/personal life. With this unique rule, those "delusional and obsessed" fans will always believe that that idol kyara they see on TV, LIVE, HS, is the reality. A pure idol without love experience/relationship. Thus, those fans will trust the idol and don't need to go deeper and search more about that idol's personal life. Even though in some cases we can see some fans try to enter member's personal life, but Sakamichi did a good job to protect it and only show what those fans need to know.

So, when a member of a group idol breaks this law, it can also affect the group and other members. The trust is gone, and those "delusional and obsessed" start trying to find more and more about the truth, which can annoy the member because a stranger tries to find about their personal life.
An easy example of that is Yanchan scandal. After Bunshun released that news, some fans even claim that Kakki and other members also have a relationship with Johnny members because she made a similar hand sign like one of Johnny members'. Kakki even had to explain it in her mobame. Runa even was afraid to make a hand sign in her SR because of that. Maybe, because of that, Yanchan had to apologize on her radio show.

So, we shouldn't believe that what an Idol show in front of the camera is their true self. Hoshino is a clear example. She looks pure and innocent, an eternal imouto, but she has a boyfriend outside her job as an idol, right? It is also similar to other members. And, if you still believe that a love ban keeps them away from having a relationship outside their job as an idol, then I can't say anything.

A quote by Kakehashi Sayaka:
"There is no such thing as pure Idol. Once a member is 10...eh...20 years old or older, they are not pure anymore."
You can find the video when she said that on the 4th gen thread.
Maybe the rule of love ban in Nogizaka? After the member is 20 years old, they can have a love relationship? Who knows?

 

Theres no written rule of ban in Nogi

But theres so called unwrritten rule
Theyre free to have love interest but dont get caught.

 

Japan has one of the lowest birth rates in the world. Enabling lonely Japanese fans to be overly attached to a delusion is a bit concerning, is it not? If I raise a child to adulthood, I'm not going to get involved in their love life, especially not when they're 23 like in Hoshino's case.

This would be the ideal scenario. Transition away from the idea of having a love ban that caters to overly obsessed individuals and let fans show support in a more healthy manner.

This is the issue. You have to be incredibly naive to think that these girls have never experienced any sort of romantic relationship outside of work. However, those sold on having an imaginary "trust" with an idol and having it broken, feel the need to lash out. Is this healthy behavior? I think not.

If certain fans disapprove of a member dating, then they can stop spending money on said member or the group altogether. Their wallets speak volumes, right? Proper fans who legitimately care for the happiness of a member will continue to show support.

 

Usually, people who against idol having relationship is WIERDO or CREEP or PEDO, or LONELY PEOPLE. Im not against a healthy normal relationship but if it is unhealthy relationship like a young girl with creepy old man or having multiple partner or adultery like ringo, that is a big no no. I dont know why Japanese still keep that weird culture, NOT FORGET TO MENTION, ONLY GIRL IDOLS USUALLY HAVING HARDTIME, WHILE THE BOYS GET AWAY EASILY. I guess people who really hates idols dating actually never got to be in a relationship and just jealous. Lol

 

Someone mentioned Kpop. So I'm here. As a fan of Red Velvet, ha.

The dating news of Red Velvet is welcoming as:

- they are considered professional, always, and talented
- majority of their fans are girls, less boyfriend stans, they rarely did fanservice; their songs are empowering after all
- the dating partner is not an idol, less (or no?) petty girlfriend stans attacked the girl and he seems nice
- the idol and partner wrote long letters to fans about the incident
- the fan community is united and healthy, they accepted the fact that their idols are supposed to love at their age and mentally prepared
- the members show their supports

The differences:

- J-idols themselves are not considered talented enough to free themselves from fanservice and girlfriend image (not all)
- Fans are mostly males
- the professionalism of Minami is in question

I do not really care about idol dating, that's their life and I will never marry them or something. But the local fans who cry for them and bulk order the album? I'm not sure.

 

New blog post

 

Quick Google Translate:

I apologize for the inconvenience caused by the news about me, fans, all the people involved, and all the members.
Regarding the press, on September 7th and 8th, I met the person who was actually in the article. Originally, I'm sorry I didn't concentrate on my work when I had to work hard on promotion activities with everyone.

Also, on September 18th and 19th, when I was absent from work, I was really sick, and I had a fever on the 17th the day before, so I asked the office to take a PCR test the next day. Although the PCR test was negative, I was absent from work because I was not in good physical condition. After that, it was difficult for me to move on my own, so I asked the person who was mentioned in the article to come, but it looked like a sloppy vacation, and as a result, I was not fully aware of myself as a professional.

I think that going out to the media will cause more trouble to the members, so I consulted with the staff and decided to refrain from promoting this single.

Even though there were people who supported me, I had to set an example as a senior, and there were everyone who worked hard together for 10 years, but it was a really unconscious action. really sorry.

 

If she stays , shes getting sent to unders for the 1st time in her Nogi Career

 

From that blog post, it seems clear that there is no dating ban. And Minami didn't explain or apologize for having a boyfriend, she just apologized for missing out work.
My feeling is she will choose love over idol career, and will graduate after her hiatus.

 

She's been there. (See 7th and 8th under songs (I am not sure if not more))

 

She was Under before, right? There's one she was made center. Although sent to Under at this point. Graduation sound a lot better for me. Well, that's the apology. Let us see what's next.

 

she's been in under for two consecutive singles 7th & 8th, and it's gonna happen again because of her Scandal, i wonder how long she gonna stay there.