1. Check the 2023 Stage48 Member Ranking Results, how did your Oshimen rank this year?

Single Keyakizaka46 9th / Last Single [Dare ga Sono Kane wo Narasu no ka?] (2020/08/21)

Discussion in 'Sakurazaka46 News & Releases' started by minaeshi, Sep 10, 2019.

  1. gish0046

    gish0046 Upcoming Girls

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2019
    MANAGEMENT canceled the concert BECAUSE Techi couldn't participate.

    Just like how MANAGEMENT delayed the single BECAUSE Techi didn't want to participate.

    When I said she canceled the concert I meant that it was canceled based entirely on her lack of participation. As in it was all about her.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Dislike Dislike x 1
  2. techizaka

    techizaka Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2019
    Oshimen:
    Oozono Rei
    Which is management's mistake from the beginning. So I still fail to see why techi is being held accountable for their poor decision
     
    • Agree Agree x 8
  3. Rover

    Rover Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2020
    How much power do you think she has lol. It's honestly ridiculous how people think Hirate has that much power. You also countered yourself by emphasizing management canceled those events. Also those events wasn't just about her, it's just that management made it about her.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  4. gish0046

    gish0046 Upcoming Girls

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2019
    Its not about accountability or blame.

    But if the question is "Did the single get delayed because Techi didn't want to do it?" then the answer is obviously yes.

    At the end of the day its ultimately management's decision but anyone who has been following Keyaki since the beginning would see that management revolved all of their decisions around Techi. And if she refused to participate in a single then they obviously wouldn't do that single.

    Talk about contradicting yourself.

    If the management made everything about her, then that means everything is about her. Right? Do you see what I'm saying now?
     
    • Dislike Dislike x 3
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
  5. DelicateEmpress

    DelicateEmpress Upcoming Girls

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2019
    Oshimen:
    hirateyurina
    But why are you so sure that Techi didn’t want to participate, hence the delay?

    Let’s sit back and think for a moment. Senbatsu announcement was all the way back in July, the episode was published in September. If she didn’t want to participate, she’d have talked to mmg beforehand and they would not have published that Keyakake ep at all. The rumor of her filming sth, the CMs, Sajins and 10gatsu, Keyakake ep that used 10gatsu as bgm, and most importantly, the senbatsu ep in which Techi said she knew some people were disappointed/had mixed feelings, they (as in everyone) would try their best to bring the highest quality to their fans, all these things point to a very logical conclusion that Techi DID participate in the single making and things were going as schedule until whatever difficulties showed up near the intended release date.
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. gish0046

    gish0046 Upcoming Girls

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2019
    Mainly because of the withdrawal. Usually when Japanese entertainment companies use the term "withdrawal" its because of a canceled contract. The withdrawal and the stagnation of Keyaki prior makes me suspect there were ongoing contract renegotiations which led to the withdrawal. What would cause them to cancel/renegotiate a contract? Maybe refusing to participate in a single she was contractually obligated to participate in? Especially when it was obvious she wasn't really happy about it, even at the actual senbatsu episode.
     
    • Dislike Dislike x 3
    • Like Like x 2
  7. keyak

    keyak Upcoming Girls

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2019
    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    Huh? :confused: Was there a statement out there released by management or any of the girls that said Techi was the reason for the delay? Otherwise, why are you acting like this is a fact?

    I agree more with @EinhanderX’s line of reasoning that management may have been influenced by fan, and perhaps media, expectations to create a better, top-notch single which resulted in further delay. I wasn’t aware that fan reactions toward the Sajin preview were lukewarm. If Techi did play a role, then at most, she probably agreed with management that the single could be improved, which further convinced management to redo it, but that decision wasn’t hers from the beginning. And then, Techi withdrew because she grew tired of waiting (she expressed grad intents as early as during Hibiki) and wanted to leave as quietly and quickly as possible without going through graduation motions.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  8. MasToppu

    MasToppu Next Girls

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2016
    Location:
    Nusantara
    Oshimen:
    Kosaka Nao
    Pon or Hikaru for new center!:)
     
    • Like Like x 5
    • Agree Agree x 2
  9. Rover

    Rover Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2020
    Yeah I contradicted myself with this statement. To clarify, what I meant was that the events was about all members of Keyaki, but management made it about only Hirate when they canceled because she couldn't attend.

    I agree and disagree. From a management perspective yes, from a fan perspective no. Management likely didn't have enough trust for the other members to perform the concert without Hirate but fans would've enjoyed the concert regardless, since many people would've liked to see the other members as well.

    @gish0046 I understand where your coming from and I agree with you that Hirate not wanting to do the single could delay the single. But at the same time I agree with @EinhanderX and @keyak arguments that at most Hirate would've been a factor in the decision at best.

    Regarding Hirate's withdrawal, I agree with @keyak that it was likely that she wanted a single of better quality but was tired of waiting as she has expressed that she wanted to leave Keyaki before.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  10. Vulpix nao

    Vulpix nao Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2020
    Twitter:
    NaoVulpix
    Discussion about Hirate is always a waste of time because they always go round and round again without anyone here knowing the facts, but indeed none of the fact are unveiled. But that's what amazing on Keyaki's boards, the thread is always alive even without anything given.

    Talk about the public live concert that possibly can't be held until the end of this year (though I'm still positive about Hinakuri 2020 in Tokyo Dome). Keyakizaka can at least release a CD first, an album of those unreleased songs that we have heard which you might assume it's still not at the main song level.

    I think they rarely judge the album as the main asset or set it as a group's benchmark, but the good thing is, it still able to get into the billboards. They could make a song for the new generation first with many unit songs as supplementary. The possible case (or maybe the worst for fans) is an album without MV, so it's a song with the mysterious formation so they could worry about the senbatsu later (and then ROCK it at the TV performance). As an exchange, they should fill it with some documentary or unreleased live concert video (Budoukan/ROK last year).
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 2
  11. turbogig

    turbogig Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2020
    Oshimen:
    Habu Mizuho
    If Techi was as manipulative and as troublesome for them, why is she still with S&F then? Surely, the bosses just love getting their plans messed up by a 18 yo girl.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  12. gish0046

    gish0046 Upcoming Girls

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2019
    Probably because they like making money? S&F have their own bosses and if they tell S&F "Hirate is a big money maker for us, make sure she's happy so she doesn't leave the agency" then what do you think they're going to do?

    You all say I give too much credit to Techi in terms of how much influence Techi had, but I think you give too much credit to management. Techi works for Sony, not S&F. S&F are just managers. They just do grunt work. Don't get managers and producers confused. Managers are expendable and replaceable. Artists and talent are way more valuable to the people writing the checks than the managers. We get confused as idol fans because idols are low level and don't have any clout and they're easily replaceable. But Techi has proven she has more value than that. I can guarantee you that the contract Techi has now lets her fire her manager. There's no way Sony is going to prioritize the wants and needs of some rando manager over their one in a million artist that can easily sell millions of records on her own, and can sell out stadiums on her own. The talent brings in the money, managers do not.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2020
    • Agree Agree x 5
    • Dislike Dislike x 3
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  13. Philosophy Senpai

    Philosophy Senpai Next Girls

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2019
    Location:
    Athens
    Oshimen:
    Saito Fuyuka
    @gish0046 That! So very true, you just described the actual reality of the business environment in the entertainment world.

    Now, regarding Techi, as I've said many times in the past, she is a charismatic and multifaceted natural-born-artist. I've never oshi her but i recognize and respect her talents. However as time passed it was evident that the Techi/Keyakizaka46 combination had reached a stalemate: the group activities and demands was dragging her down and was not allowing her to recover from her injuries (caused by these very activities), while at the same time she was blocking any possible untapped powers and talents the other girls may have had in this group. Unfortunately, this may (I say may/probably - I am far from being certain) have caused a series of graduations as collateral damage.

    Now, thanks god, they are both free to flourish. The future looks better for both Keyakizaka46 version 2.0 and the solo Techi...
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Like Like x 1
  14. minaeshi

    minaeshi Next Girls

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2014
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Oshimen:
    Morita Hikaru
    Twitter:
    minaeshit
    @gish0046 While I do agree with the difference between management and producer, it still doesn't make sense to me why you would think Techi alone has the power to delay an entire single. Yes she works for Sony, but so does the song producers, lyricist, music video directors, editors, choreographers, stylists, and the 'expendable management team' that schedules live performances, books venues, and gives activities to the girls. They, including the members themselves, are all collectively part of the production team that work under Sony.

    So if techi voiced her intention of not wanting to participate in the single after it was already completed, they would have simply put her on hiatus throughout the single promotional period (which they have done before), and have other members cover for her. Sony wouldn't decide to completely redo weeks or months worth of hard work done by the entire production team, because she alone did not like it. And honestly, I don't think techi or any of the members, are selfish enough to make their entire team do that, knowing the consequences it would have on their group.
    If the wants and needs of the groups management team directly affects the group's marketability, Sony will prioritize that. Techi cannot manage herself. She gets her schedule from her manager the day before and turns up as required, and if she couldn't perform, they would replace her with another member. As a soloist, she now has the power to delay a production featuring her if she doesn't like it, but as a member of a group you simply cannot do that. So again, to point the finger at a single member who isn't even considered a legal adult in japan and still comes into work in her school uniform, for being the cause of delaying a single, and having the power to do that?... i'm sorry it just doesn't make any sense to me. I'm looking at this as a member of a production team that works with celebrity clients, not as an idol fan.

    If anything, it's managements fault for failing to see the faults in the current system they had in place, regarding having a sole member as the face and center of the group. It's a gamble and the chances of you getting it right and excelling perfectly is close to none when you look at idol groups as large as keyaki who have implemented this system.
    You can get the wrong member and have to backtrack and try out other members until you pick the right one (Nogizaka Ikoma).
    Or you could get the right member and go full speed ahead until said member decides to graduate and everyone wonders if they can do it without her (NMB48 Sayanee).
    You could also get a member who consistently gets hate for being forced into the same position every time, and eventually graduates after hyperventilating/fainting on stage, injuries, and general exhaustion (AKB48 Acchan, SKE48 Jurina, Keyakizaka Techi).
    And as we can see, they still haven't learnt their lesson because Hinatazaka, while doing an incredible job, are going the same route with the eternal center. The group is still new, so the effect have yet to be seen.
    The blueprint of using an eternal center seems to work when you look at it from a business standpoint, but the affect it has on the idol itself can end up dire. The 'expendable management team' that works under Sony will continue to use this blueprint until it breaks, but until it's broken they will not fix it. So no, it's not techi's fault, never has been.
    All these groups have the same thing in common; they are extremely successful, and eventually the groups can survive without the original eternal center in place.

    Please remember that Sony allowed techi to leave, be it through graduation or withdrawal. And she's still under S&F, she's still under Sony so there isn't any hard feelings between any one group of people. Techi can be free to work her creative mind in her own space on her own time, just as others have done before her, and Keyaki will adapt to this new situation and grow into a stronger group.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2020
    • Like Like x 4
  15. rdamon42

    rdamon42 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2019
    Oshimen:
    渡邉 理佐 / 守屋麗奈
    Twitter:
    rdamon42
    Geez, I thought we were done with the Techi talk. I guess its my fault for bringing it up. I miss her, so sue me.

    Moving forward and looking to the future is more fun, and speculating for the senbatsu and lineup for the single. Debating about Techi is like going in circles: those who love her, love her, and those who are polarized by her will remain so.
    [​IMG]

    You have no idea how happy this makes me :) go Ten-chan!
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Dislike Dislike x 1
  16. minaeshi

    minaeshi Next Girls

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2014
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Oshimen:
    Morita Hikaru
    Twitter:
    minaeshit
    ^ my fault lol, i've got nothing to do in this damn quarantine so i had time lol

    I completely bypassed that list, it's so good??? I'm not sure how I feel about a Risa center (i feel she's more suited to a Mariko role like Habu) but Yuipon, Hikaru, Tamura and Ten would be my choices for a new center 100%. We talk about center a lot but who do you think will be in the senbatsu if they decide to make a new one? A lot has changed from the senbatsu announcement till now, so it would interesting to see where they go with this.. Ten's popularity has skyrocketed and i don't see them still not including her. There's also another spot to fill, so that could go to Matsudaira to allow all 2ki a chance at senbatsu together. They could even remove more 2ki and 1ki in favor of the fresh 2nd gen members to push them quickly! The possibilities are endless and i hope they experiment a lot and cause a stir lol
     
    • Like Like x 2
  17. asakuraikun

    asakuraikun Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    May 30, 2019
    Oshimen:
    Inori / Ten / Tamami
    Those were my bets, except for Pon which I thought would rank a bit lower (but it's not surprising, she's popular). Risa is very popular among fans of the first generation, I think it would be both a good and safe choice.

    2ki needs something as quick as possible, so it would be no surprise to get a second generation center now. Actually I'd be satisfied with any of the ranking members (Hikaru, Ten, Hono and Karin), if we don't get a new permacenter, we'll have plenty of options for the future - which is the best scenario imo. Despite the lack of new content (and bad luck, like the pandemic) the group has good options in both first and second generations. Now it'll become a bit harder to pick the senbatsu though ^^'
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  18. Dill

    Dill Next Girls

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2017
    Oshimen:
    Techi
    At this point I think the safe route would be a full senbatsu, without the new2ki, Pon-Hikaru as w-cewnter and a coupling song for 2nd gen only. TakeYui would be my center but I don't believe it myself lol
    The new members are also quite captivating so if not this time I'm curious to see them too on senbatsu soon.
     
  19. Hunter

    Hunter Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2015
    For senbatsu, I think a must have is Miichan, it's kinda weird she was out. I would love to include Nijika and Fuuchan too, since imo their voice and dance is really good, and they deserve to be in senbatsu, even more when we dont have much 1ki left. While I think group now need a stable center/ace to promote as the new face to the the public, Pon could be one, even as transition period center (much like Mayuyu), we need more, at least one person as equal too for group's stable ( I talked about this Kami7-Fukujin before ), so 1ki-2ki Wcenter would be best for me, especially Pon-Hikaru
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Agree Agree x 2
  20. Hunter

    Hunter Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2015
    And btw, W-center is not impossible, cause seeing Garasu wo Ware I remembered the time when management tried out Yuichanzu Wcen it, and it was great too. At least that shown they thought of this possibility
     
    • Agree Agree x 1

Share This Page