When will the '46' Group become too much like '48' Group?

I dont know if this is interesting enough to warrant its own thread, but I'll create it and see how it goes anyway.

Since Keyakizaka46 debuted, Nogizaka have been drawing parallels to 48 Group, saying they're basically the 48 Group System now with the birth of a sister group. Personally I'm okay with it, since it won't cause a backlog of potential new girls getting a chance to shine, seeing that Nogi is already struggling with promoting their 2nd generation and some of their 1st generation.

If they start to introduce kennins then I would be hesistant but can still accept that there's a difference between the two Group systems. The only event which I would think they've crossed the line and become AKB48 is if they introduce a Senbatsu Sousenkyo, since that was one of the original appeals of this 'rival' group when Nogi first debuted.

So what do you think? What step/event could management implement that would convince you that they have just turned into AKB48 Group? Or do you think they've already reach that stage, and in which case when did it happen?

 

For me the more they've become like the 48group means they're more independent and not dependent on AKB. Having a sister group is one thing. Soon, Nogi will have a dynasty if it's own they won't really have contact with the 48g

 

hmm for comparison with 48 I think we can distinguish the comparison to style & structure. I'll start with style.

Style-wise, I don't think either nogi nor keyaki is at risk of becoming like 48 groups. A brief history on nogi's style; while when nogi was formed initially there was no clear concept, after the initial experimentation a very clear style have developed (in a spontaneous way from the members too!), specifically the talented but approachable ojousama image with heavy emphasis on fashion modeling, musical acting, more class/conservative gravure appearance, & musics are are considered less "idol-ish." We can see this from the roster of six official models, the many mag corners & frequent modeling appearances; the many musical acting such as Princess Knight, Principals, Vampire Knights, Dogs to Heaven, Joshiraku, & more. Even in gravure, which nogi have been appearing on for a long time, there's always a notable style divergence from 48-groups. One just need to look at an nogi-featured issue of EX-Taishuu lol, a rather erm, explicit? magazine & compare nogi's pages to other pages. Peach John is a good example too I guess.

Looking at keyaki now, I think style-wise there's even less worry on becoming 48-like lol. While during nogi's initial audition I don't think mngmnt selected girls for particular styles (many of the chosen ones simply happen to be of the aforementioned style I think,) for keyaki tho now that it is clear what nogi's image is like I think it is a consideration, hence how many keyaki girls seems to be even more ojousama-like than nogi lol


Structure-wise I guess is where the concern truly arise. As @kanjo have said above tho when it comes to quantity of membership there's still a large difference. 48-group also have it's origin in the theatre & stages, which I don't think nogi/keyaki will ever come to emulate. Looking at it recently, I think nogi have a rather empowered roster of Under members too, which I feed differs from 48-groups large roster of theatre girls (albeit we can say it's just a sign of fortunes these days maybe?) I also don't think it's likely nogi/keyaki will have sousenkyou, altho if they do it will be the point in which answers the question affirmatively.

 

But i won't be surprised if Keyaki decided to open audition for 2nd gen in less than a year

 

i think when they have their own sousenkyo and too much bikini gravure. i dont like the sister group thingy because basically it will diverge the attention towards the other group. and im pretty sure to avoid that, they will put kennin in nogi because there is no way they cant promote a 46/48 group without attachment to its mothership. maybe they will try go independent but the growth might be slow because attention is towards nogi right now.

 

When will the '46' Group become too much like '48' Group?
Intresting question after all. I think truth is just opposite ( or not). Listening these Singles name songs: first them sounds like AKB48(?), or sound them? (Because that think is taken that first singles mv youtube comments.

Alternative and more: When 46 become too much like E-girls?

Sounds like these countdown, which think 46 group is too much like 48?

 

in my honest opinion the moment the 46gs had their own variety shows and and own dramas and now sister groups was the moment I said to myself the 46 faction has become just like the 48gs.this isn't a bad thing at all by any means the issue is can they do it better than their 48 counterpart and I think yes because technically anything after akb48 was just an inmitation or a mimic but I do believe nogi46 has their own unique style especially as far as music goes and the characters we see on these shows.so I think they were already like 48g they just make it look better.

 

For me it's three things,
1. Lot of kennin in nogi songs
2. SSK
3. Another sister group

If they cross those lines, I don't see any difference anymore between them and AKB.

One line they definitely should cross though is more bikini gravure lol

 

Nogizaka46 is still several steps away from AKB48.

To name a few off the top of my head:
- Several sister groups
- Abandonment of the idea of 46/48 members maximum
- Sister group members coming to dominate singles
- Elections
- Overseas sister groups
- Theater
- Gimmicky auditions (Draft, Otona AKB, Baito AKB, Team 8)
- Set List

 

@rust I actually think that Nogi was very much a "pure" style from the beginning (i.e., their debut single), especially since gravure has always been the crux of criticism towards the 48G. While your other points have merit, some (like the musicals and under performances) are really more an indicator of Nogizaka's rise versus AKB's slow decline.

The truest test of how different the two will be is, IMHO, the variety shows. The more 46G pushes character, the more I think they will end up being too much like 48G. Even AkiP made a big statement about how 46G girls will never be allowed on any of the major variety shows (i.e., Mechaike) just because that would break the "image" that he's creating for them.

 

hmm while I agree Unders lives is definitely reflective of nogi's general rise, I'm not so sure about musical. Back then when I was still very much into AKB, I never got a sense that there were many musicals, or that it's a big part of 48's identity. I know there were some, but they're few & far between. Unless I'm mistaken? Conversely, every since the first Principal, musicals have always feel to be part of nogi's identity. I guess maybe iku's musical background & goals have contributed to this, or maybe it's because of several members' interest in acting lol.

oh where did he said that?

 

Now i am mess up. Are Aki really said that? And when...

Anyway... what in 46 g road?

 

While it's true that Principal is very central to Nogizaka46, musicals are also (while not central) important to AKB. Things like the Oz competition have been really important since the start of AKBingo, after all. Furthermore, the casting is also reflective of how in-demand members of Nogizaka are right now in the industry.

As for AkiPig's quote, it was on his 755.