How come K-pop fans don't branch out to AKB48 and J-pop in general?

Discussion in 'The STAGE48 Lobby' started by mdo7, Apr 14, 2016.

?

what factor is turning off K-pop fans from becoming potential fans of J-pop and AKB48 in general

  1. accessibility

    18 vote(s)
    40.9%
  2. not being open-minded to other Asian pop

    25 vote(s)
    56.8%
  3. former J-pop fans turned K-pop fans not introducing J-pop to current K-pop fans

    2 vote(s)
    4.5%
  4. weird music video, concept (yet K-pop has concept which "out-weird" J-pop)

    8 vote(s)
    18.2%
  5. other factors (please list them on the thread)

    10 vote(s)
    22.7%
Multiple votes are allowed.
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  1. ABF48

    ABF48 Member

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    @mdo7 see the flag under one of my pic -,-

    and u'should read my post again and understanding it. iTunes japan held their own market. not all country can access it. why ? bc their market size are big enough for that, they have their own authority.

    http://www.idownloadblog.com/2015/10/04/apple-music-foreign-japan-account-in-usa/
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2016
  2. mdo7

    mdo7 Kenkyuusei

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    Sorry I didn't look carefully. But K-pop became the first Asian pop to have a genre on US Itunes, as the Soompi article said:

    The bold and underline sentence I highlighted is significant because no Asian Pop outside of Asia has ever had a genre on US Itunes. It's a big historical moment for K-pop, not even J-pop was able to achieve this.
     
  3. ABF48

    ABF48 Member

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    see ? in the end you're just too biased in kpop, and you will kick off every opinion that oppose you.


    ^ u'should read this again. iTunes japan held their own authority.

    and why so proud about kpop was able to emerge US market ? only international fans cares about that. and for me nowadays there's nothing special about going through inside US market. i think you american ppl need to keep your head down, its not like US market are the center of the world. y'know how kpop nowadays are tend to ignore US market and be more active in china and japan, bc why ? bc they get more money in there.

    And if you compare US to china, i mean.. china was never been the target of kpop until recently.. so here i'll say that US market, the land of dream of all human, was starting to fades. well, at least thats what i see in kpop market these days. i still remember how kpop was so obsessed to US market tho. but todays, it seems they are trying to get rid that idea.

    and dont y'know some popular US or even world artist are promoting in japan, it means US/worlds market are recognizing how big japan market is. and y'know what.. they never doing that in korea or any other asian countries. like i never seen some world artist performing in music bank or inkigayo, while in contrast.. i've seen a countless time world artist are performing in music station japan and promote their music in there.

    in the end u cant deny the fact that japan market was big, and it was big enough to the level "why they need to promotes outsides japan when their domestic market are big enough to make a living for their life". and kpop market was never as big as japan market, thats why.
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2016
  4. mdo7

    mdo7 Kenkyuusei

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    No, the purpose of this thread is to get AKB48 and J-pop fans thinking why J-pop didn't get as big as K-pop. Didn't you bother reading the disclaimer at the beginning. The purpose of this thread is not to antagonize AKB48 or J-pop. It's a critical thinking thread.

    Actually a lot of K-pop idols are not going to Japan a lot like they used to. I think you may want to read these:

    Korean Wave waning in Japan due to political friction: Bin Tajima

    At KCON Japan, decades-old flame for Korean culture rekindled

    I'll quote from the Yonhap News article:

    Geez even last year, NHK is going to stop showing Korean dramas. That's why Korea has been so focused on China, but they still take the Asian, US, Latin/South American, and European market seriously. If they didn't take the US market seriously, we wouldn't have KCON.

    Just for the record, China is not even on the top 10 music market at all. Yet K-pop still target the Chinese market more then Japan. So Japan being the 2nd biggest market doesn't seen relevent today no matter how much you keep reminding me.

    I don't know if they take the Japanese market seriously. But I've seen evidence of USA taking the Korean market more seriously then ever. I mean several western artists I recall hearing has targeted South Korea and just skip Japan. I have another article that back this up:

    Korean pop emerges as Asia's music hub via international collaborations

    and I'll quote from the article:

    Because US is #1 biggest music market, yet they still promote their artists outside of USA and make their music accessible to a global audiences.
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2016
  5. ABF48

    ABF48 Member

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    coming from someone who's hard headed at how kpop is much more supreme than jpop, look at your post, you always antagonizing jpop, and look at how some people already explained where the weakness or strongness of jpop, but still you always counter attack all those opinion.

    duh y'know all thus political thingy between japan and korea were always like that since you were unborn. but kpop is still doing fine as ever in japan. you need to proccess what you read first, AND PLS YOU DONT NEED TO BELIEVE TO ALL THUS ARTICLE, be more open minded please.

    oh really ? dont make me laugh :hmm: ... okay, let me explain. the physicals sales in US are worse than japan. Y'know all kpop or world artist are going to japan to throw up their physical sales bc japan is basically the biggest CD market in this planet.

    wow, where's this comin from ? as long as i knew, japan is always the first target of kpop market. I mean seriously ? china is the main target of kpop ? lmao, i mean.. of course china is one of the main target of kpop, but really.. they never come out until recently.

    but i'm glad you understands how kpop is starting to targeting china. do you know the reason ? i tell you, their sales in china are went out like crazy. for example bigbang lastest album sold more than 600K in china, thats explain how big china's market is, and thats also explain why YG throw away their idea to debuting bigbang in US.

    Okay, i tell you the actual condition here, actually it never been like this before, not until the booming of exo in 2013. and after the succes of exo, all other kpop big act like bigbang etc started to expanding to china. but before that, kpop was never approaching china. not until today when kpop has become rlly big in china, and tbh kpop was never this big in china before. i'd say todays is the kpop peak in china.

    Also jpop too with the influence of SNH48 and 48G they started expanding their market in china through their sub group, they also planned to make another sub group in china like BEJ and GNZ. wich i believe once they held sousenkyo together, their sales will went up like super crazy.

    china is basically the future land of dream.

    name who's kpop act who goes to china or USA right now and then compare it to the amount kpop act who goes to japan, you will see the difference. japan is still priority.

    i dont want to make it long but there's a lot of jpop act that make some superb collaboration with international artist. i can name some of them, like sekai no owari, babymetal and one ok rock. and even AKB was collaborating with disney, with "Sugar rush"
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2016
  6. mdo7

    mdo7 Kenkyuusei

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    And you're not concern that J-pop is not getting any audiences outside of Asia when K-pop is doing this. To be honest, I would be more concern about other Asian countries trying to replicate K-pop success and try to target the non-Asian audiences. Meanwhile J-pop and J-music industry are not taking the international market seriously.

    I don't really care about strong or weakness of J-pop, my biggest concern is that the J-pop international fandom aren't even pushing J-pop to go global meanwhile fans of other Asian pop like Taiwanese pop are wanting to have the same global success like K-pop.

    Well Japan going to have to go with the time, unfortunately. All I hear is that paid digital download and streaming is going to be the future for music. CDs are going to be there but not as quite significant as it was long time ago.

    OK, then explain why China is not even on the top 10 music market? you didn't even answer that. I'll quote from Billboard:

    Source:Billboard-Seven Takeaways from IFPI's Study of the Global Music Market Last Year

    4minute-this group never made any Japanese comeback since 2012

    IU-She never made a Japanese comeback since 2013.

    T-ara-this once popular girl group hasn't made a Japanese comeback since 2014.

    God even Girls Generation hasn't made any big comeback in Japan. Their last Japanese album was released in 2013.

    I also know more K-pop that have not make any Japanese comeback or doing less comeback in Japan. But China, that's a different market even though it's 19th largest market, I mean have a look:

    China is the new eldorado for kpop

    SM Entertainment shift market from Japan to China

    Chinese Investors Pump Billions Into South Korea's Booming Music Industry

    It doesn't mean anything. So how come they're not like well-known in the US compared to K-pop counterpart. I mean whenever K-pop does a collaboration, it get a lot of attention and "buzz" online and get attention from some mainstream media. Yet when J-pop does it, nobody (except J-pop fans) seem to care.
     
  7. ABF48

    ABF48 Member

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    Apr 23, 2015
    wha.. what ? i'm enjoying jpop in my own way and i'm happy for that, and in my country jpop community is still like crazy, so i'm fine. and.. this "J-pop and J-music industry are not taking the international market seriously" is only your opinion, and.. its only just you.

    of course i knew that, like who the hell in this world still buy CD's ? but japan WAS still doing that, so ? as long as they are still doing that, their market interest will keep growing no matter what.

    okay thats not the point. but at least i already giving an explaination about how and why all those world artist were selling their music in japan.


    i dont know -,- Kpop were just suddenly became so popular in china, bigbang in total sold 3million copies of their album, EXO fans buying bulk of cds as much as full packed truck. they're literally crazy with their oppas -,-

    and about why china is not one of the biggest music market, i believe its connected with this http://www.billboard.com/biz/articles/news/1431803/ifpi-reveals-list-of-worst-piracy-offenders . As you know china is one of the paradise for piracy crime.


    okay, but you're just going back and forth with this, i dont understands why you brought this. dont make me more confused..


    you picked a wrong person i tell you, i was an SM stan, i know everything about SM. SM was still struggling to monopolize kpop japanese market. Next month NCT japan will be debuted, in another side, EXO also just debuted in japan last year and they're promoting like crazy in japan as SM wanted exo to become the next TVXQ. and next month afterwards, SM will held SMTOWN concert in kyocera dome and Tokyo dome, and all SM artist will be attended this concert. SM basically never forget where all those money comes from, at the old days.. literally all SM profit were comin from TVXQ activity in japan.

    Yay, i was fan of IU since her debut, i know all updates about IU. IU just held her fanmeeting in japan two month ago, so she basically didnt forget about her japanese fanbase. she's busy right now with her upcoming new drama. IU was recently became more active in china, IU popularity started to rising in china on early 2016 and after then she become more busy with her activity in china. but again its only attending fanmeeting and doing her concert stuff, and its not like she will debuted in china anytime soon.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2016
  8. Ashitaba

    Ashitaba Upcoming Girls

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    K-Pop has done a much better job at reaching out to the Korean diaspora in other countries, and by proxy people who already were into asian music flocked towards it. K-pop has interesting coreographies, lots of sex appeal, and a westernized feel to it that might make it more approachable than J-pop. Of course there are tons of people outside of Asia interested in J-pop, but in general they don't bring enough revenue for the companies in Japan to actively reach for them. Also, I'm not sure if Japanese diaspora is that interested in J-pop as much as they are interested in the music produced in the countries they live in... it feels like the J-pop scene is not that appealing outside of its bubble, while K-pop has a much, much wider appeal.
     
  9. True_Beginner

    True_Beginner Kenkyuusei

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    I was referring to the slave contracts when I was talking about distance, but yes I do understand K-pop fans support them from criticism, which isn't anything new from other western artists. The truth about slave contracts is still too negative for anyone to want to approach, and it's not going to reach anyone's attention regardless of how big and loud the fanbase appears, because they aren't trending on social media with the attention of your average person, just within their own inner circle like any other foreign music fans. Fans of J-Pop or K-Pop are used to the rules these idols go through, so I don't see that attitude changing. Minegishi's incident blew over as most people expected...because no one is really going to care enough in the end what happens somewhere else, for the most part.

    Also, K-pop fan culture seems more competitive and image conscious with itself, just as the content itself is either trying to appear or sound cool.

    Also, J-Pop scandals don't always generate hate either...that's a generalization, they're probably treated no different from K-Pop ones, just less fighting.




    Social media isn't going to reach anyone but who is connected to that kind of news, whether it's K-Pop or whatever. Those kind of stories grab onto a large userbase of fans, not put directly in front of the rest of the world. The fans might be from all over, but they're looking on a computer screen to something that only pertains to them. Their numbers don't justify the importance, that's not the kind of point I was making.



    I think a lot of solid points have been made already, and I'm not surprised to read if K-Pop was moving away from the west more...they have a brand that appeals to a lot of different countries, like plenty of American acts that tour the world.
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2016
  10. Trinu

    Trinu Under Girls

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    The answer is quite simple.

    Kpop fans are as rabid as Directioners and Believers (who will send you PMs on fb if they see you criticising their gods) while Jpop ones are much quieter in comparison.

    The way their showbiz are dealt with is also very different.
    Kpop uses a lot of yellow press (ala USA) to get people talking (omg CL and her instagram, omg Jessica and her bf, omg oppa hugging a girl) while I don't see much news of the sort in the jpop world.

    Also, the kpop industry kinda forces the fans to stick together with their whole YG, JYP and SM families competing against each other (heck, they even tour together) while the only similar thing in Japan is Avex doing the a-nation over the summer.
    Like I'm gonna check who else is in King Records just because AKB is there lolnope

    So yeah, the fandoms are different because the industries are catering to different demographics.
    Plus, since when does anyone have to try out "other asian music" just because they like a certain country's music?
    That, imo, is kinda racist.
    I don't listen to music because the singers have some physical characteristics, but because I like it. And that goes from the indiest of Icelandic bands to NCT (who are all my boyfriends and you b*tches will stay away).

    So yeah, peace out.
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2016
  11. TCS Kennedy

    TCS Kennedy Kenkyuusei

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    I actually wish K-Pop was a bit more bit insular like J-Pop... just a bit. When Gangnam Style came out, I would have non-Korean friends rant about the song having no idea as to what the context of the song is about. Although I thought Hyuna being the next one up after that was even more embarrassing. Even more recently, there's Keith Ape's wtf release "잊지마 / It G Ma"... although I'll give props for its Korea-Japan collaborative effort. The only reason now why there would be Japan-Korea tensions is because the old generation doesn't want to let that hatred go. Btw Kohh apparently is half Kor/Jap.

    Although it really can't be helped in some ways, say when particular Asian-Americans go back to their motherland countries. Although, not adjusting for genre, Ailee's promotions in Korea for example would garner more attention stateside than Hillary's friend Kylee. A good amount of that I attribute to where they're from, as Kylee and Hillary are both from Arizona, while Ailee represents northern New Jersey, which contains two big Korean concentrations in Rutgers University and Bergen County. Plus I believe half of the reason why there are K-Pop concerts in the US is for the Koreans living in the state. (although I had more chances to see a K-Pop act in my area, such as Jay Park at the Verizon Center, but I've been to none :p However I was able to see Puffy AmiYumi and AKB48 live :shocku:)

    The only J-Pop "act", outside of Baby Metal, that I can see cause a buzz when they're in town, is Utada.

    Btw @mdo7, is that AoA's Choa for your avatar pic...?
     
  12. mdo7

    mdo7 Kenkyuusei

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    I will agree that J-pop scene doesn't seem appealing despite K-pop artists singing songs in Japanese, this still doesn't answer the question why K-pop fans don't branch out to J-pop.

    Also I don't understand the whole "overseas market don't bring enough revenues in Japan" logic crap. If that's the case then Hollywood would not be pandering to China aka "China Pandering" despite China being the 2nd largest movie market and is worth 1/3 of the US market. I mean look at this:

    [​IMG]

    So applying this same logic to Hollywood/US movie industry, I wouldn't waste time pandering/catering to the Chinese market. Although I was told that China's movie market has grown for the last 2 years and this is predicted here:

    [​IMG]
    But I'm still skeptic of the whole Chinese move market will surpass the US one. But speaking of China, since you brought up Japanese companies don't bring enough overseas revenues. Here's another question: How come Japan's film industry don't pander to a growing Chinese market when Hollywood and South Korea (yes, South Korea has been pandering to the Chinese market and does co-productions with China) does this? I mean if Hollywood and South Korea are pandering to the Chinese market, why didn't Japan's film industry do the same?

    That's the thing that doesn't make sense to me and I say that as a K-pop fan, anime fans, and a observer/critic of Asian pop culture.

    Actually, rabid J-pop fans does exist, there used to be a lot of rabid J-pop fans long time ago according to a 2009 article I stumbled upon. After reading that article, I get the impression the J-pop fandom was very much similar to their K-pop counterpart. If there are rabid anime fans, then there's going to be rabid J-pop fans too.

    Just for the record, there's been an increase of K-pop concerts in the US, even in area that don't have Korean or Asian-American community like DAY6 did a fanmeeting in Orlando Florida.

    No that would be Sooyoung of SNSD/Girls Generation.

    No they haven't move away from the west. I've seen KCON expanded to other areas beyond Asia and US like KCON was a big success in the UAE. Now CJ E&M is going to expand KCON to France making it the first KCON in Europe.



    I suspect KCON may expand to more areas outside of Asia like there is a strong possibility of one in Australia, another one in Europe (I think London, UK could be another site), and one or two in Latin/South America (I think Brazil and Mexico would be the right locations for KCON's Latin American debut).

    I'm going to say one more thing here: As long as K-pop continue to use Youtube and Naver V App to keep international K-pop fans stay in touch, I don't think K-pop will go away anytime soon.

    Actually not every J-pop fans share your opinion. As I said, there are J-pop fans that aren't happy that K-pop is getting all those international exposure. There are some in the J-music industry that called for J-pop to be more global and they cited K-pop/Hallyu as an example. I take it you didn't read my post at Quora carefully because I included a 2011 interview from Ai Takahashi, former member of Morning Musume has spoken out about making J-pop more global, she cited K-pop overseas success in Asia (this was before Gangnam Style went viral, Billboard USA creating the K-town column, and Itunes USA creating K-pop genre):

    Takahashi Ai Speaks Of A Global Jpop

    Ai Takahashi: Japanese Idols and the Overseas Market

    2011 article: Potential of J-pop idols unlimited

    Did J-pop fans around the world come together to make her wish come true? Nope they didn't. It's not only Ai Takahashi that call for that. Gackt has blasted the Japanese pop culture companies and Cool Japan for not trying to put effort into rivaling South Korea. I remember seeing another article calling J-pop and J-music to be more global and they cited K-pop oversea successes:

    Pop culture clash: There's more to Japan's kawaii culture than manga

    Also I found an interesting article from a fillipino J-pop fansite bringing up something interesting:

    Stop Making Excuses: A Challenge to Philippine J-pop Fans

    One person made a interesting comment and I like to quote that:

    So yes, J-pop accessibility has been a big issue and that lead to J-pop global fandom not as big as it was.

    Well as I said, Japan will have to go with the time. You can't relied on CD sales.

    Well yes that's correct. But yet, South Korea is still taking the Chinese market despite all the rampart piracy.

    Because I've been observing the K-pop industry for quite a while, as I've seen Japanese comeback are becoming less and less frequent. There are less Japanese comeback in 2015-2016 then when the Hallyu in Japan was active in 2011-2014.

    Doesn't mean anything, Lee Soo-Man said it on record that SM is cutting Japan's profit from 70% to 50%, at the same time he said that he's increasing China profit by 35%. If Japan is still worth a market, then why cut Japan's market from 70% to 50% and jump on the Chinese market?

    I may have an answer and I forgot to mention this on my previous post. Were you aware that the weakened yen has made K-pop in Japan not as profitable as it was:

    Has Japan’s K-Pop bubble burst? Weakening yen hits major Korean record label hard

    I did some currency conversion today and found out that the Japanese Yen is not as valuable to the Korean as the US dollar and Chinese Yuan:

    Japanese Yen to Korean Won:

    50,000 Yen= ₩ 538,477.27

    Chinese Yuan to Korean Won:

    50,000 Yuan= ₩8,846,525.17

    US dollar to Korean Won:

    $50,000= ₩57,269,750.00

    Even the Euro and the British pound is worth more then the Yen to the Korean:

    Euro to Korean Won:

    50,000= ₩65,556,032.51

    British Pounds to Korean Won:

    £50,000= ₩83,666,544.92

    So this make sense why K-pop is making less Japanese comeback and activities and started focusing more on China and to some extent, western market. It also make sense why KCON has expanded to France. And doing some currency conversion seem to back up my point.

    Not making a Japanese comeback to me signal that the hallyu wave in Japan has already decline. In China, the Hallyu never died, and it's been going on since the late 90's. I've been seeing less and less Japanese comeback from K-pop idols.
     
  13. ABF48

    ABF48 Member

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    ofc it is, but worse than that, not every kpop fans sharing the same opinion like what you had in there.

    I can recall that too, but as you stated before, not every jpop fans are like that.

    First, Idk anything about takahashi Ai, and i dont care about her. Its not like you care about all kpop idol right ? And at that time, in 2011, AKB was already conquerring japanese market and me.. who once was kpop fans.. become jpop fans and become fans of AKB.

    And tbfh morning musume success is far less than AKB success. wich like as you knew today, they're literally taking east asia, southeast asia market as a whole.

    you cant always expect them to comeback every year, they have life and career in korea wich they need to pursue. Anyway, as per what you say, now i do understands that you clearly didnt have any clue on what happening with kpop in japan right now.

    BIGBANG just made a comeback last month, Apink, AOA, VIXX, BTOB, and the trends, BTS!! they all started to promotes in japan.. also not to mention EXO will focussed in japan onwards.

    And i still can name many of them bc.. as you know, kpop idol goes to japan is somehow has became like a routine part time job for them u,u

    Coming from someone who know nothing about SM -,- cutting their jap market ? lol you clearly knew nothing about SM. As i stated before, SM will debuted their new group NCT in japan, basically to maintain their money and profit in japan. And not only that.. since TVXQ was in loss due to military service, so they've sent EXO to be more focussed in japan activity.

    Dont playing fire with EXO-Ls i warn you. Today SM was sending their biggest money maker to japan, today EXO was in japan to held their fanmeeting in budokan.

    "EXO Fan Meeting at Budokan Japan from May 1st to May 3rd (5 session) the venue have capasity of 14,500 seats"

    [​IMG]


    And as a said before, EXO will be the next TVXQ bc why ? bc this happen..


    [​IMG]



    So waht ? SM leaving japan and swift to china ? Nope, they expand to china bc at that time they still have TVXQ in japan, so they didnt have anything to worry about. But then the problem suddenly appeared as TVXQ need to go due to millitary service, so yeah.. since SM didnt want to loss their market shares in japan. In exchange they sent EXO as replacement, and it does implied that they leaving chinese market and goes to japan.


    idk about 90s bc i was still unborn at that time, and... no kpop act was ever dared to goes to china to sell their music till SM made a way on kpop second boom with EXO success in china. and when i said kpop second boom, it means kpop first boom in china. get that ?

    This just simply a bullshit -,-


    ......

    ......


    Anyway this coming from americans popular youtubers..

     
    Last edited: May 1, 2016
  14. mdo7

    mdo7 Kenkyuusei

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    you're going to need proof to back this up. Because all I'm seeing is K-pop winning on online poll against western artists. Also I've been a long time observant of the K-pop fandom and industry so I know what's really going on in the industry.

    Those are exceptions, but I'm seeing these same artists doing a lot more promotion in China like Big Bang for example. But you disregard 4minute, and T-ara (who at one time was very famous in Japan), these 2 have not made any Japanese comeback. Even Girls Generation has not made a big comeback in Japan, so that seem to tell me that the Japanese market is not quite as significant as it was.

    But you didn't explain to me why SM is cutting Japan's profit from 70% to 50%, also explain these:

    SM Entertainment Continues Expansion To China With Mandopop Star Search Program

    Alibaba Invests in Korean Talent Agency SM Entertainment

    So if SM take Japanese market seriously, why are they getting money from Chinese companies and in return they prioritized China over Japan? I don't see SM doing these type of expansion in Japan currently while China get most of this.

    Wrong, I'll cite this article:

    After 20 years, S.M. Entertainment to expand overseas base

    I'll also cite this:

    I also remember that there were other Korean group beside H.O.T that became well-known in China and this was before EXO became a hit in China like Baby Vox.





    other sources: Onehallyu

    So care to explain how my money conversion is "bullshit"? The Japanese yen is not as good as it was back then. That's why K-pop making Japanese comeback are becoming less and less frequent.
     
  15. ABF48

    ABF48 Member

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    I'm sorry what ? poll ? winning against western artist ? i mean.. it doesnt have anything to do with the topic we talked here -,-

    First. As i stated before, Bigbang make a crazy sales in china with their lastest album, "M.A.D.E" was in total sold 3million copies in china. Thats why.. and actually in my whole life as a kpop fans, i never seen YG was this passionate towards chinese market. And thats why i believe YG will forgot their US/western project like CL and PSY, bc they have made more money in china.

    Second, 4minute and T-ara was never popular in japan.

    :fp: .. even for me who dont really care about them, i'll say that you basically know nothing about girls generation, please read about their recent phantasia tour, they have three concert in japan wich made japan as the main focuss on this year concert.

    now i ask you, did SNSD ever debuted in china ? nope!! and y'know what.. they also once made a debut in US but then failed miserably.

    anyway.. this happening

    [​IMG]



    You trust this article ? you doubting me as a real SM stan ? -,- and all my explaination seemed useless for you *sigh* tbh i really hate this kind of article, it only made idol look like nothing but just money maker machine... and ugh i hate that guy !!! KYM was basically the worst CEO ever, they overworking EXO and look at what happens after then, we lost three member :fp::fp:


    well idk about that, bc in 2000 i was just like 3yo, and i know nothing about kpop, but i know for sure.. at that time C-drama is much more popular in my country, and Japanese culture such as anime was boomin in here. But something that i knew from learning, the first hallyu wave is not about kpop, but about kdrama.. wich actually it was something like "Winter Sonata", "Endless love", "Jang geum", "Full House" etc. and note !! its not about kpop in the first place.


    Because its bullshit, and it didnt have anything to do with Kpop sales o_O .. i mean, i dont even knew the relation between those money concversion with kpop lmao

    ugh not again with this "Japanese comeback are becoming less and less frequent.".. i'm out !!
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2016
  16. Trinu

    Trinu Under Girls

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2010
    Location:
    Earth-616
    @mdo7 so if you're going to refute or deny everything, what's the point of the discussion? lol

    Why Kpop fans don't listen to more Jpop?
    Probably cause their songs are catchier and the videos more entertaining.

    Kpop biz is also similar to America.
    They release some music, go to some shows and then spend the next year updating their IG and flirting around. Teens eat that shit up and turn into their biggest chaperones. All those online polls you talk about? Other boybands were winning it before kpop even mattered.
    Jpop artists are much more frequent in their releases and much more modest in their social media, so all their fans get is... the music.

    As for why kpop is trying China now lol again WHO KNOWS?!?
    The fact is that kpop artists NEED to expand overseas out of need (piracy is so big in South Korea that no major Hollywood studio releases dvds there anymore). Anywhere they go they're gonna make more money than in their home country.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2016
  17. mdo7

    mdo7 Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    May 27, 2014
    Location:
    Cypress, Texas
    Twitter:
    mikedo2007
    Yeah, it sort of does. Because everytime K-pop does something like this (ie: Girls Generation/SNSD winning against western artists like Justin Bieber, Lady Gaga, and One Direction at 2013 YTMA, and T-ara beating One Direction on Billboard army face off) it seem to give K-pop more spotlight then J-pop are getting.

    I highly doubt that. Ever since K-pop has try to make it's presence in the US. They've been trying to make a dent in the US market. I highly doubt CL will give up her American ambition because she work really too hard and to make it this far.

    Well you haven't back up your fact with real evidence. I'm sorry that picture of somebody claiming something is not enough (that can be a rumor for all I know). Don't tell me you trust these rumors, do you? You need an article to back this up. And I'll use this Kpop herald article as an example:

    EXO, TVXQ, SHINee likely to hold more concerts in China

    and I'll quote:

    So yes, I'm doubting you as a SM stan because you keep claiming that SM is doing well in Japan despite Lee Soo Man has said it on record that SM will cut Japan's profit from 70% to 50%, and increase profit in China. I'm not sure what plans SM has for market outside of Asia. Unless you give me a real evidence (like an article from a credible source, I can't take your word for it).

    I don't know why you keep saying that SM artists are doing well in Japan despite they are focusing more on China (ie: Yoona is appearing on a Chinese period drama), sure EXO is a new sensation in Japan but when they were first formed, they were meant to target Chinese and Korean market (do you know why there's an EXO-K and EXO-M, but not a EXO-J?). It was never SM intention to have EXO to debut in Japan. They had them debut in Japan because well yeah one reason is the absence of TVXQ, and also EXO got a growing fanbases in Japan despite being made for the Chinese market, so SM can't ignore the fanbases (they get some profit along the way, but you have to take the fandom seriously).

    There's been talk about Girls Generation may debut in China, that'll depend on the circumstances. The only reason they failed in the US is because they did a US debut before Gangnam Style, and Girls Generation winning the YTMA in 2013. If SNSD/Girls Generation has debut today, they probably would become a household name in the US.

    When did you become a K-pop fan? Sound like you need a little refresher:

    4minute: they won Kpop New Artist Award at the 2010 Billboard Japan Music Awards. They sang a theme song for a Japanese show. They also collaborated with Aoyama Thelma. They were even cited to be the most popular K-pop girl group in Japan back in 2010. Their contract with Universal Music Japan expire in 2013 (2nd source: Onehallyu).

    T-ara: Their hit song, Bo Peep Bo Peep was #1 in Japan. Three of their Japanese albums ranked high on the Oricon chart. They even talked about their popularity in Japan. After they signed up to promote in China (and also releasing songs in Chinese), they cease any Japanese activities/promotions. However, I just found out T-ara are going to meet their Japanese fans in May. So I hope they can reconcile with their Japanese fanbases after being absent for sometime.

    I don't know what this has to do with what I said. You said it yourself that and I quote from you: "no kpop act was ever dared to goes to china to sell their music till SM made a way on kpop second boom with EXO success in china." That's wrong, 2 K-pop idols (H.O.T, and Baby Vox) became famous in China even before EXO became big. Baby VOX's name appeared on a English-language quiz in China in 2011.

    You don't get it, don't you. Sales of CDs is not really the point, it's the profit made from each country. Japan will probably get less profit for K-pop then China and USA combined. I mean sure Japan is the 2nd largest market, but guess what with the weakened Yen, and the tension between Japan and South Korea hurting K-pop profit, that's why K-pop's profit from Japan may not be as high as it was during 2010-2013. That's why they're targeting the Chinese market despite piracy risk. That's why I show you the money conversion of Yen-Won, Yuan-Won. There's a big differences on how K-pop companies can get money by the countries just by doing monetary conversion. I won't denied that K-pop sold a lot in Japan, but they golden time is over. Only quite a few K-pop act can make a lot of achievement.

    I'll agree the video from K-pop are more visually appealing then J-pop (judging from the video I've seen online). However the one from Johnny's boy group can hold some candle to K-pop standard.

    Whoa, I'm not denying anything you said. When somebody or you said or suggest something what caused J-pop fandom to fall, and it doesn't add up I have to dispute that because I can find something similar or equivalent in South Korea and people accepted it (like Japan being too weird for westerner to accept J-pop yet South Korea's infamous dog meat consumption didn't turn off people from becoming fans of K-pop and K-drama). Just for the record I ask these same questions on other forums, and a lot of people I talked to don't have a definitive answer. Just like me a lot of people said they were baffled by the J-pop fandom just suddenly collapsed.

    About the DVD not being release in Korea, you're correct about the piracy. But there's another factor why DVDs aren't being released in Korea anymore, it's because Korea is wired as in the internet and this lead to IPTV and VOD replacing DVDs:

    2008 article-Internet Video in Korea Eclipses the DVD

    2008 article-Warner Bros. to release movies online before DVD in Korea

    Yeah and one thing lead to another:

    4K UHD VoD services of Korean IPTV service providers

    Warner Bros. Launches VOD Service for New Movies in Korea

    BBC Worldwide clinches new VOD deal in South Korea

    But when I was in Korea on vacation in 2014, I saw DVDs (not pirated one) up for sale. So yeah there are still market for DVDs but not as big as it was before VODs and IPTVs became a big thing in Korea.

    About Korea taking the overseas market, that wasn't always the case. A long time ago before Hallyu and K-pop, South Korea was used to be "stubborn" like Japan when it comes to the overseas market, they didn't take the international market back then like today, they used to carry the same "self-sufficient" logic like Japan. It wasn't until the 1997 Asian Financial Crisis and other negative images about South Korea that made them change that logic. So South Korea long time ago went from "uncool" to now "cool" even "out-cooling" Japan in the pop culture game. How do I know this?

    Source: The birth of Korean Wave (I read this book like a religious text, this book explain everything about how South Korea from uncool to cool, that include)

    There's one more thing I want to add, I remember seeing this thread on Onehallyu:

    Why do Kpop fans treat Japanese comebacks as if they aren't REAL comebacks?

    Well the response to that thread was a bit ambigious because majority of them said it's due to accessibility, others said that they don't watch Japanese comeback because "it doesn't count" to K-pop fans. Again, this lead to J-pop fans accusing K-pop fandom of being racist against Japanese (which relate to K-pop fans double standard to J-pop).

    Also even before K-pop went global. K-pop has it own share of weirdness, I'm going to include this (but with spoiler covering it).

    Warning: Once you click it and see it, you can never unsee it. It might require brain bleach to remove that image from your head. If you don't want to see it, don't click on the spoiler.

    [​IMG]
    Source: Popseoul, Kpopstarz

    and this came out way before this commercial below:

     
  18. ABF48

    ABF48 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2015
    why do i need that ? when i know what is actually happening. I know their project, i know their concert, i know their schedule and activity, i know everything about them, and i'm updating all the news about them everyday and everytime. Wheter its inside or outside, i know everything.. bc i following them for real. Actually i dont care about those article and i only brought that bc you always brought the same thing over and over again. but its okay.. i'll give you the link.

    https://twitter.com/sberryeol/status/724964754960306176
    https://twitter.com/milkysehun412/status/724999222639075329


    Okay you brought this article but can you list any actual event about this ? bc i really cant find any follow up about those events

    nope, dont bring EXO Planet #2 bc it was planned long before thats article come out. Anyway pls look at their income details : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exo_Planet_#2_-_The_Exo'luxion?oldformat=true


    You get that ? still dont get it ?

    and tbh this researcher was stupid bc LSM was not held any power in SM anymore. LSM basically has retired, tho he still managed to have position in "Management and Artist departement", thats why he still can create the newest group as like NCT and RV. wait.. do you know about that ? do you know about LSM and KYM sect ? do you know wich group is under them ? lol i'm sorry for oot.

    read again what i've writen at above, i also already give you the link to the article, and it was the newest one ^o^

    First, I'm not saying they're doing well, i'm just letting you to know that todays they're more busy in japan rather in china, just a simply giving you an accurate information. Wich you keep persistent it was not, and keep saying all SM artist are going to china and leaves japan, when in reality they are NOT (EXO are having fanmeeting in japan today, TODAY). and todays reality are simply implying that they're prospecting more in japan. -,-

    Seconds, i know more than just yoona starring in chinese drama, she's new to all this chinese thing. tbh if you focussed on individual activity i'd say they're more active in china (Sehun, Chanyeol, Lay, Krystal, Victoria), bc there's no restriction in that country, not like in japan, and also each individual has back up agency wich supporting them, again its not like in japan. But remember!! when it comes to Group activity, they are more active in japan.

    I'm glad you understands, about them being converted to japan focussed promotions by now. but...this "(do you know why there's an EXO-K and EXO-M, but not a EXO-J?)" ..really ? This is an basic knowledge for EXO-ls or even for Kpop fans, and imo even non-fans can answer this easily. Okay then.. i want to ask you if you really do pay attention to exo or not, Do you know what EXO-M do in china ? why OT12 became OT9 ? wich country EXO-M do more promotions, China or Korea ? can you answer that ? too hard ? okay, what the meaning of EXO ? this just basic knowledge for exo-ls tbh.

    okay thats not the point, what i want to say here is.. you're just a simply outsider who judging from outside, and you dont rlly know what happens inside the fandom, more on that inside the group.

    Popular in here i mean.. a real popularity. Not popular made by article -,- bc at the end of the day, the only girlgroup that made into real popularity in japan is only KARA and SNSD.

    I'm not economical person so yeah i never understood thus things. But on your note, all what you say in there is just a theory, and what happens todays was...kpop still doing fine in japan, why i'm saying this ? bc i saw so many group are debuted in japan like usual.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2016
  19. BlackSwan

    BlackSwan Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2016
    Oshimen:
    moriyaakane
    Twitter:
    TaintedWingsFS
    Mmmh, I thought we'd just shared our point of views, not linking several external articles.

    As a 48G fan I (currently) don't see any appeal (at all) in K-pop. Also, I am not bothered if K-pop has more exposure in U.S.A. (?)
    I mean, good for them. It's not like J-pop is gonna die.
    Lastly I think that J-pop/Idols fan are seen under a bad light.

    You follow K-Pop? You see Half-naked girls showing allusive movements? It's okay, dude.



    You follow J-pop? Omgz, why u watch underage girls, you pedophile weaboo!?

     
    • Winner Winner x 1
  20. Baratheon

    Baratheon Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    May 30, 2014
    Location:
    Salatiga
    Why people buys and eats pizza more than burrito? How come people who eat pizza do not branches out and tries burrito? Why is pizza more popular around the world than burrito? Why people who enjoy burrito does not unite and rally to promote burrito so that it get more recognition as pizza?

    From fans' pov. It is that simple. PREFERENCE.
    People who enjoys burrito will still enjoy burrito even though pizza win the award for the most delicious food on earth. And ofc there are people who enjoy both.
    From the artists' pov, if they need to get recognized worldwide, they'll try. Look at CL tried to collab with US artist. Look at One Ok Rock right now doing guerrila concert around the world.
    If they don't, they won't. I believe they each have counselor and researcher for that.

    J-pop is not that seemingly popular here in Indonesia, I mean the fans communities (aside from AKB because we have JKT) in comparison to the popularity of KPop, but you know what, when AAA or OOR held concerts, they sold full house, just like Kpop concerts. My point is, J-pop is still popular and has a lot of fans but it is not being talked and hyped as Kpop.
     
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